Comments on: The Indian Army Part 4 & 5 http://indianeconomy.org/2007/06/27/the-indian-army-part-4-5/ Issues & insights Sat, 22 Aug 2009 15:19:02 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.0.1 By: Dinesh http://indianeconomy.org/2007/06/27/the-indian-army-part-4-5/comment-page-1/#comment-268663 Dinesh Wed, 24 Sep 2008 15:39:35 +0000 http://indianeconomy.org/2007/06/27/the-indian-army-part-4-5/#comment-268663 Thanx a lot for the valuable information. Thanx a lot for the valuable information.

]]> By: jai http://indianeconomy.org/2007/06/27/the-indian-army-part-4-5/comment-page-1/#comment-268475 jai Fri, 22 Aug 2008 04:10:15 +0000 http://indianeconomy.org/2007/06/27/the-indian-army-part-4-5/#comment-268475 A Colonel Researching “How to improve the service conditions of PBORs. What a JOKE. You must be suggesting that all PBORs should be made to work in retired officers houses. OR how to get best lady fingers for officers mess from Jawans' ration. A Colonel Researching “How to improve the service conditions of PBORs. What a JOKE.

You must be suggesting that all PBORs should be made to work in retired officers houses.

OR how to get best lady fingers for officers mess from Jawans’ ration.

]]> By: E I Abraham, Ex-Hav.AEC http://indianeconomy.org/2007/06/27/the-indian-army-part-4-5/comment-page-1/#comment-265556 E I Abraham, Ex-Hav.AEC Thu, 24 Apr 2008 23:41:44 +0000 http://indianeconomy.org/2007/06/27/the-indian-army-part-4-5/#comment-265556 Another thought. There are many officer vacancies in the army to be filled in. However, there in no shotage of officers in the army. That not all the vacancies are really officer vacancies other than an administrative opinion. We successfully fought two wars between 1965 and 1971 with the same or higher shortage. I am Ex-Service with MA and Ph D college degrees. I think there is no shortage but a policy matter. Re structure of the army needed. Higher Educated men, train them for higher responsibilities, promote them to JCO ranks with higher resposibilities at earlier age and promote other ranks to officer cader if qualify. As the economy growing faster I do not think enough financial benefits can be gained by many highly educated intellectual in the military. When the economy was poor military bebefits were higher but no more. I know a 10 year computer engineer in the civil making about Rs300,000 month and enjoys the good civil life, after refused a military rank. In my case after higher college degree joined as Education Havildar and posted me far from home Kerala State about 3000 away at Line of Control border post in Kashmir at my handsome youth. And lived like an illetrate uneducated "Jangilee" there for 3.75 years for a tenure of 3 years. Had to stay 0.75 years more there on good team work with all and no one wants to prepare my movement order to new location. For my ability I would have been an officer but have had no administrative code. So I had no other choice but to leave. Another thought. There are many officer vacancies in the army to be filled in. However, there in no shotage of officers in the army. That not all the vacancies are really officer vacancies other than an administrative opinion. We successfully fought two wars between 1965 and 1971 with the same or higher shortage.

I am Ex-Service with MA and Ph D college degrees. I think there is no shortage but a policy matter. Re structure of the army needed. Higher Educated men, train them for higher responsibilities, promote them to JCO ranks with higher resposibilities at earlier age and promote other ranks to officer cader if qualify. As the economy growing faster I do not think enough financial benefits can be gained by many highly educated intellectual in the military. When the economy was poor military bebefits were higher but no more. I know a 10 year computer engineer in the civil making about Rs300,000 month and enjoys the good civil life, after refused a military rank. In my case after higher college degree joined as Education Havildar and posted me far from home Kerala State about 3000 away at Line of Control border post in Kashmir at my handsome youth. And lived like an illetrate uneducated “Jangilee” there for 3.75 years for a tenure of 3 years. Had to stay 0.75 years more there on good team work with all and no one wants to prepare my movement order to new location. For my ability I would have been an officer but have had no administrative code. So I had no other choice but to leave.

]]> By: Col Saxena http://indianeconomy.org/2007/06/27/the-indian-army-part-4-5/comment-page-1/#comment-265550 Col Saxena Thu, 24 Apr 2008 07:04:59 +0000 http://indianeconomy.org/2007/06/27/the-indian-army-part-4-5/#comment-265550 Dear All, I am working on a Research Paper which speaks about , "How to improve the service conditions of PBORs(Personnel below Officer's Rank i.e. JCOs & ORs )and their Future employability in the post-retirement period". I invite Analysis and Suggestions from one and all. Col Saxena Dear All,
I am working on a Research Paper which speaks about , “How to improve the service conditions of PBORs(Personnel below Officer’s Rank i.e. JCOs & ORs )and their Future employability in the post-retirement period”. I invite Analysis and Suggestions from one and all.
Col Saxena

]]> By: sarah http://indianeconomy.org/2007/06/27/the-indian-army-part-4-5/comment-page-1/#comment-265091 sarah Tue, 25 Mar 2008 09:28:41 +0000 http://indianeconomy.org/2007/06/27/the-indian-army-part-4-5/#comment-265091 how many people are in the army ? how many people are in the army ?

]]> By: DR E I ABRAHAM, Ph D http://indianeconomy.org/2007/06/27/the-indian-army-part-4-5/comment-page-1/#comment-264978 DR E I ABRAHAM, Ph D Sun, 16 Mar 2008 11:12:55 +0000 http://indianeconomy.org/2007/06/27/the-indian-army-part-4-5/#comment-264978 Shortage of officers in the military forces is a long standing problem yet fought several won wars. Re-structure of the officer level to current number of officers is an option that many estimated positions can be avoided. Furthermore, too many officer presence shall create indiscipline too. Since educated men are more in the forces today opportunities to them to faster promotion to Junion Commission Officers and so on brings morale high and seeking early realease by other ranks. Many join the service with great insight but diminishes once enrolled. Able personnel from Other Ranks should get chances to advance is better than massive hiring of Commissioned Officers. Ex-Hav AEC Edayil Ittycheria Abraham, M A Political Science Agra University year 1967. Served at the extreme edge battlefront 1965 war at Sialkot Sector - Chawinda and 1971 Bengladesh war. In the US and British service, regardless of educational, a recruit or soldier who is found capable is Commissioned. I heard a Malayalee ( Kerala State ) high school student boy in the USA run away from parents and joined the Army. And during the BOOT CAMP ( basic training ) on skills elivated to Commissioned Officer and in the US military Indian Origin Officers are more than below ranks, almost all of them joined below rank officer. There is no shortage of skilled men in the Indian Army but the shortage is righteous policy. In 1965 April at J&K Domana Jammu, I stood First among 50 candidated in the written examination 85%, but at a brigadier interview I was not selected for the Service Board on reason I was already a soldier and AEC Havildar. So many higher skilled soldiers in the Indian Army are serving under tension from lower skilled higher ranks and it is my experience too. Shortage of officers in the military forces is a long standing problem yet fought several won wars.

Re-structure of the officer level to current number of officers is an option that many estimated positions can be avoided. Furthermore, too many officer presence shall create indiscipline too.

Since educated men are more in the forces today opportunities to them to faster promotion to Junion Commission Officers and so on brings morale high and seeking early realease by other ranks.

Many join the service with great insight but diminishes once enrolled. Able personnel from Other Ranks should get chances to advance is better than massive hiring of Commissioned Officers.

Ex-Hav AEC
Edayil Ittycheria Abraham, M A Political Science Agra University year 1967. Served at the extreme edge battlefront 1965 war at Sialkot Sector – Chawinda and 1971 Bengladesh war.

In the US and British service, regardless of educational, a recruit or soldier who is found capable is Commissioned. I heard a Malayalee ( Kerala State ) high school student boy in the USA run away from parents and joined the Army. And during the BOOT CAMP ( basic training ) on skills elivated to Commissioned Officer and in the US military Indian Origin Officers are more than below ranks, almost all of them joined below rank officer. There is no shortage of skilled men in the Indian Army but the shortage is righteous policy.

In 1965 April at J&K Domana Jammu, I stood First among 50 candidated in the written examination 85%, but at a brigadier interview I was not selected for the Service Board on reason I was already a soldier and AEC Havildar. So many higher skilled soldiers in the Indian Army are serving under tension from lower skilled higher ranks and it is my experience too.

]]> By: karamveer singh http://indianeconomy.org/2007/06/27/the-indian-army-part-4-5/comment-page-1/#comment-264516 karamveer singh Fri, 22 Feb 2008 12:09:18 +0000 http://indianeconomy.org/2007/06/27/the-indian-army-part-4-5/#comment-264516 the officer as well as the jco are feeling burden of the shortage of officer. however this burden can be lessened by selecting graduated and qualified jco for the officer post. there are many jco retiring before the full tenure of their job. there should be some criteria to select the jco who are capable of becoming officer.some of the jco are more capable of doing than what they are getting to do now. so, some steps should be taken in this regard. the officer as well as the jco are feeling burden of the shortage of officer. however this burden can be lessened by selecting graduated and qualified jco for the officer post. there are many jco retiring before the full tenure of their job.
there should be some criteria to select the jco who are capable of becoming officer.some of the jco are more capable of doing than what they are getting to do now. so, some steps should be taken in this regard.

]]> By: Pragmatic Euphony » Blog Archive » The seats at academy are always full http://indianeconomy.org/2007/06/27/the-indian-army-part-4-5/comment-page-1/#comment-263741 Pragmatic Euphony » Blog Archive » The seats at academy are always full Thu, 17 Jan 2008 19:38:32 +0000 http://indianeconomy.org/2007/06/27/the-indian-army-part-4-5/#comment-263741 [...] One of the other tasks of the Sixth Pay commission is to suggest reduction in the size of the government. The Army baulks and chafes at any suggestions of rightsizing. A quarter of the defence budget of Rs. 96,000 crore goes towards the salaries, while the defence pension bill of Rs. 14,000 crore is not counted towards the defence budget. Make no mistake, the issue of rightsizing the military is unrelated to lowering of guard for national security. It is about cutting wasteful expenditure - to get more bang for the buck [related posts here, here and here]. [...] [...] One of the other tasks of the Sixth Pay commission is to suggest reduction in the size of the government. The Army baulks and chafes at any suggestions of rightsizing. A quarter of the defence budget of Rs. 96,000 crore goes towards the salaries, while the defence pension bill of Rs. 14,000 crore is not counted towards the defence budget. Make no mistake, the issue of rightsizing the military is unrelated to lowering of guard for national security. It is about cutting wasteful expenditure – to get more bang for the buck [related posts here, here and here]. [...]

]]> By: Harmilapi Naresh Kumar http://indianeconomy.org/2007/06/27/the-indian-army-part-4-5/comment-page-1/#comment-250974 Harmilapi Naresh Kumar Sun, 04 Nov 2007 20:01:23 +0000 http://indianeconomy.org/2007/06/27/the-indian-army-part-4-5/#comment-250974 India needs the Army to defend itself as well it has the major roll in the Global political issueS and to keep peace."It was his wordings during the 1971 war with Pakistan on Bangladesh issue".Now I think his dreams are becoming true.(My father expired in 1993 on 26th of Jan. after watching the Republic Day Ceramonie) may father was the Indian Army Captain(Ret. in 1974, participiated 1n 1942-1945(2nd World War)1949,1962,1965,1966-1967(UNO Vietnam),1971 and many other things I did,nt knew. India needs the Army to defend itself as well it has the major roll in the Global political issueS and to keep peace.”It was his wordings during the 1971 war with Pakistan on Bangladesh issue”.Now I think his dreams are becoming true.(My father expired in 1993 on 26th of Jan. after watching the Republic Day Ceramonie)

may father was the Indian Army Captain(Ret. in 1974, participiated 1n 1942-1945(2nd World War)1949,1962,1965,1966-1967(UNO Vietnam),1971 and many other things I did,nt knew.

]]> By: Naveen http://indianeconomy.org/2007/06/27/the-indian-army-part-4-5/comment-page-1/#comment-189244 Naveen Sun, 01 Jul 2007 03:58:00 +0000 http://indianeconomy.org/2007/06/27/the-indian-army-part-4-5/#comment-189244 a very well written post .... let me highlight a few more aspects which i felt were left out here ... 1.The shortage of officers has imposed an additional burden on the serving officers more than on the JCOs/NCOs as mentioned by you. However this can be suitabily addressed by exercising carefully selected JCOs and NCOs after requisite training.This is possible only if higher echelons within the organisation and government appreciate the situation correctly. 2. You have mentioned the increase in intake of cadets at the Academies, but it is only if you look carefully that the subtle but sure fall in standards get marked.Quality will only come if you respect it. Ditto is the case with Defence Research organisations. 3. The government will never have any qualms in sending the army on UN assignments because the reimbursements it gets is a huge.The soldiers get only a pittance.The economies of countries like Bangladesh and Nepal get a major boost just because of their UN peacekeeping commitments.The developed countries will never like to send their armies to war torn countries because of the following reasons:- A. The pay given by UN to the peacekeepers is not much compared to the pay intheir armed forces. B.The risk factor involved and domestic political pressures linked with it. One must remember that the value of human life in developing countries (especially in south asia)is a pittance compared to the west. a very well written post …. let me highlight a few more aspects which i felt were left out here …

1.The shortage of officers has imposed an additional burden on the serving officers more than on the JCOs/NCOs as mentioned by you. However this can be suitabily addressed by exercising carefully selected JCOs and NCOs after requisite training.This is possible only if higher echelons within the organisation and government appreciate the situation correctly.

2. You have mentioned the increase in intake of cadets at the Academies, but it is only if you look carefully that the subtle but sure fall in standards get marked.Quality will only come if you respect it. Ditto is the case with Defence Research organisations.

3. The government will never have any qualms in sending the army on UN assignments because the reimbursements it gets is a huge.The soldiers get only a pittance.The economies of countries like Bangladesh and Nepal get a major boost just because of their UN peacekeeping commitments.The developed countries will never like to send their armies to war torn countries because of the following reasons:-
A. The pay given by UN to the peacekeepers is not much compared to
the pay intheir armed forces.

B.The risk factor involved and domestic political pressures linked
with it. One must remember that the value of human life in developing
countries (especially in south asia)is a pittance compared to the
west.

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