Comments on: Defence Pensions: Worrying Signs

By: Older Crow

Older Crow — Fri, 04 Jul 2008 11:51:41 +0000

This chest beating about the size of defence pensions is clearly the work of a person who chooses to close his/her eyes to reality. If the 85% of the retirees, the figures being that of blogger and not mine, were given a second career in police/para military/central police forces,the pensions would shrink dramatically. It would also take away, at one stroke, the frustration among the men. But it would also take away the ability of distributing largesse and opportunity for nepotism for the political and the bureaucratic classes. Thus, a simple step, so obvious, has not been implemented so far.

6th CPC, for all its shortcomings, has focused attention on this aspect. Let it be implemented forthwith.

By: Oscar

Oscar — Thu, 03 Jul 2008 04:08:43 +0000

It is all very well decrying the army for all the ills that plague the nation. When the army does not get a say in matters that concern it ( procurement of arms & eqpt, 6th Pay Commission etc) and the so called babus decide what is good or bad for the army, then this is what happens ( a chinese debacale- a la 1962). It is all very fine, when you are based in a city (or atleast a town), surrounded by your near & dear ones, warm, comfortable, cozy and secure in your home firm in the belief that there is the ARMY MAN out there roughing it out for your safety, comfort & your tomorrow, while his families & his today/ tomorrow itself is not safe and further becoming unsafe due to callous, unbecoming comments by uninformed, misinformed arm-chair experts on the security of the nation, economy and the MILITARY MAN. “Esteemed” countrymen, citizens of my DEAR NATION, how long have you been away from your near & dear ones? Have you had to miss out on attending important family events, birth of your child, the final rites of your father/mother, the first step/ word spoken by your child because you were deployed in some god forsaken place guarding the security of a thankless, remorseless and an ungreatful brethren.If you think the Army is corrupt, you require to take a relook (also before you point a finger of accusation you should know that five point back at you…Satish, what is your line of work– are you on of the indian bureaucracy???). The Army is the only organisation where individuals are promptly brought to book for corruption, for instance like in the TEHELKA case… The civilian counterparts (culprits) are still at large leading easy life without an action having been taken against them & some of that very ESTEEMED lot is in charge of governing the nation this very day…. What have you to say????

By: ramesh

ramesh — Mon, 16 Jun 2008 13:15:02 +0000

read off the cuff comments by many having no knowledge of ground realities about defence services.MOD is staffed by 75% civ and 25% by def servicemen[max].all maj decisions on def matters/deals/purchases are made by non uniformed [IAS]staff/politicions finally.imagine what would have happened during Kargill problem if army was half the strength of today .when on ground it is a game of numbers in every thing,besides,ofcourse, the quality of equipment/trg/leadership.

By: subash

subash — Mon, 02 Jun 2008 16:48:11 +0000

It is good to discuss subjects related to security of the nation. For too long there has been no such public discussion under the false notion of SECRECY.This has led to many uninformed view expressed above.If we question every aspect of Armed Forces, then possibly we may get many useful suggestions.Such analysis is continuously happening in theGovt(Ministry Of defence) where overall strength,Teeth To Tail Ratio,Mechanisation,use of Simulators and Robotics etc are discussed.Generating ideas for Brainstorming can be done by all and sundry but proper analysis can only be done by only knowledgable persons and decisions taken by people who have to shoulder the responsibility for the results.Since decisions taken regarding Defence would take a very long time to show results and probably only during a next war, hence decisions have to taken carefully.
A soldier joins the service not only for the obvious pay but with an assurance that while he is serving the nation at its borders and even in the sad event of his demise, the nation would lookafter his family.So no one should crib about the pension bill. we may reduce future intake or alter pay and allce for future intake, but compensation package of existing serving and retired personnel have to compensated as promised otherwise no one would join a service which has NO easy exit.Let us offer comments on this subject very carefully.

By: rajiv

rajiv — Wed, 28 May 2008 08:39:01 +0000

A large army required or not for India? Well, intelligent question. Absorbing military men after some years of service into para military forces. Another intelligent and viable option.But the pension bill? Whether for those retired from the army or para military, they have to be sustained for giving their best years in the service of the nation. This is one cost the country has to bear for securing the sovreignity and safety of all countrymen. It will do well to remember that the armed forces are not only meant for the borders but also to secure internal calamities. Why does a man build a house. For his own security and that of his family? Look at the cost or financial burden he shoulders and for something which he is not sure whether he will live to enjoy in old age. He may might as well die at an early age! So why undertake the expenditure and go through the financial burden? I hope the intelligents(sic) are getting a point. Vested interest, corruption and the like wil exist with mankind. Can one wish away such evils? When there is no concrete answer or solution to all these then questions then why throw the burden on to the people who have at least ventured out to give a bit of their patriotism in the name of their brethren who can sleep in peace most of their nights because someone at the borders stay burn their midnight oil to ensure it.

By: DC

DC — Tue, 27 May 2008 12:19:43 +0000

We do have a huge army and such huge army is a necccessity because of the unfortunate fact that we are surrounded by china, pakistan and bangladesh(If u doubt it refer indian history). suggesting to cut it short becuase it is costing us a lot is no way to go. Rather comeup with ideas to absorb retired personnels productively.

Moreover replacing army men with technology is a noble idea but given India is not as rich as USA, not feasible. And having more army men and low technology suits India(though unfortunate) as unemployment rate in India is high unlike some other countries.

On the issue of corruption and productivity, army is not the only segment where these two evils r found.

PS- avoid statements like “India don’t need army” or “enemy is in our head”, seriously dude what were you thinking.

By: Curious

Curious — Sun, 25 May 2008 12:50:35 +0000

Besides finding out ways to reduce burgeoning pension bill of the defence forces, the establishment needs to plug the leakages too.

Corruption in defence is colossal. Despite the exposure by Tehelka a few years back, the situation has not improved. Hwo does one plug this menace and drainage of exchequer?
Indian Defence is also among the top importers of defence equipment in the world although we continue to support 40 ordinance factories across the country. Its alleged that the army does not use the ammunitions supplied by these factories due to its inferior technology and/or impact.Why not close down such factories and/or outsource some of the products like unforms (one of the 40 factories only makes uniforms) from other places?
Apart from the staioned personnel, the defence is also sitting on billions of dollars worth of real estate in major cities. A case in point is Bengaluru, where defence probably owns half the city’sland leading to congestion & traffic jams in a fast growing city. Can the defence reassess its requirement of real estate and maybe sell out prime land in the citites & settle for “strategic locations” outside the city limits?
The defence is indeed a good training ground for teamwork, strategising, dynamic planning and much more. Why don’t they start a training institute for civilians (where the young graduates of the top institutes in the country can spend 3 months learning these inputs and pay for it too) instead of drafting them ?

All such measures & much much more would hopefully generate enough surplus to maintain our defence forces in line with the demands of modern-day warfare. All said and done, inspite of the fact that India is one of the chaotic democracies; one of few surviving institutions that we can still be proud of ,is our defence. The establishment (read the government) should endeavour to make it better & modern and not ruin the process for the lack of a few bucks.

By: R. Gopal

R. Gopal — Sun, 25 May 2008 07:20:38 +0000

I hope guys like Satish are very few in numbers in our country. He is a fit case for conscription to begin with. Let him undergo the rigour and the grind of military training and be posted to a remote field area for three years.

By: Lt Gen Rajgopal

Lt Gen Rajgopal — Sun, 25 May 2008 03:56:11 +0000

Late Gen Sundarji, predicted this in 1986 when he made a presentation to the PM(Late Rajiv Gandhi) during one of the Army Commanders’ Conf. I was present at the Conf. He warned the PM that the pension bill will overtake the pay bill soon if we maintain a standing army of over 10 lac men. He was willing to release the inf soldiers after 5 yrs of service and they could form the reserve in case of emergency. But he insisted that his men should be absorbed in para- military duties which required similar trg and not left ‘on the streets’ after their service in the Army. Some of them can be absorbed in the other arms/services depending upon their qualifications/aptitude. Gen Sundarji provided some facts & figures to stress his point.

Rajiv Gandhi was ’sold’ to the idea, but he couldn’t implement the suggestion since the ‘babus’ in MHA didn’t want to lose their kingdom and successfully torpedoed Gen Sundarji’s suggestion! We now know as to how many ‘para- military’ forces are in the Home Ministry and they are ever expanding! But they still fall back on the Army when they can’t handle the situation!

Even now it is not too late. As some one has suggested earlier in this web site,we should give military trg to all able bodied men for two years and we will not need a large standing army which is a drain on our economy as a ‘revenue’ expenditure. Hope this Govt will wake up and act!

By: Indian

Indian — Tue, 08 Apr 2008 08:17:18 +0000

some times one wonders why did we join the defence services. i have served and have taken part in the wars. i am proud of the service and of the country.But some where along, all the definitions have changed. today`s young men would rather outsource the defence of the nation(satish?)on the west to the neighbour there and in the north to the neighbour there. young men today are concentrating on the mammon only and the pride in the nation has taken a back seat. writing such things in the blogs is hurting and should be discouraged especially articles from those who have never served in the services.